--- Log opened Wed Jun 29 00:00:01 2005
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01:52 < dmacks> !seen dmalloc
01:52 < Melian> dmacks: i haven't seen 'dmalloc'
01:52 < dmacks> dang, melian, pull your e-head out of your e-ass!
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09:23 < cirdan> nmorning all
09:23 < newmanbe> Hello.
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10:43 < Leafw> Hi. Does anyone know if it is possible to enable window shading in apple's X11 ?
10:46 < baba> WindowShadeX?
10:46 < Leafw> is that an app?
10:46 < Leafw> I wanted it for X11 only, but it is then for all apple apps?
10:47 < akh> Leafw: It depends on the window manager.
10:47 < baba> yeah
10:47 < Leafw> right. Which leads me to think that quartz-wm may have shading as a hidden option
10:47 < Leafw> that is what I was asking
10:47 < akh> Ah--I'm not sure about that.
10:48 < Leafw> I'm just too used to have windows in place.
10:49 < Leafw> and WindowMaker crashes under apple's X11
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10:56 < drm> howdy
10:56 < baba> hi drm
10:56 < drm> hi baba
10:57 < drm> anybody knows a little být of autoconf/libtool stuff?
10:57 < pogma> nobody awake
10:58  * baba points pogma, he know! he knows!
10:58 < pogma> what's up?
10:58 < newmanbe> baba: He's not awake. :)
10:58 < drm> pogma: indeed you shouldnt be awake :0
10:58 < baba> he's awake, just drunk
10:58 < robilad> hi pogma 
10:58 < pogma> baba: still working on drunk
10:59  * robilad wishes he was drubk
10:59 < pogma> reminds me, whiskey in the freezer
10:59 < baba> yeah, u r drubk
10:59 < robilad> will be working on it later
10:59 < drm> libtiff has been updated, and theyre using autoconf for the first time, pogma
10:59 < pogma> library version number hell?
10:59 < drm> not a bad job, but there is one place where they shouldve liýnked to the liýb they just built
11:00 < drm> i
11:00 < drm> e
11:00 < drm> now they build both lýbtiff and libtiffxx and libtýffxx needs to liýnk to libtiff
11:00  * robilad is happy as he today got kaffe to build on both darwin and cygwin
11:00 < drm> (sorry about the i)
11:00 < pogma> drm: can you put it in your exp?
11:01 < drm> pogma: on friday i can
11:01 < drm> in a somewhat remote location now, can only type
11:01 < pogma> drm: or email what you've got to me, I am on my way to bed pretty soon
11:01 < pogma> drm: yeah, how're the holidays?
11:02 < drm> i hacked a solution, not sure 
11:02 < drm> if its ok
11:02 < pogma> drm: if it works, it is probably fine
11:02 < drm> pogma: lots of fun, but too much ridýing on busses between archaelogical sites
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11:10 < akh> Sounds like my elementary school field trips.
11:10 < pixelfairy> anyone get minicom working? im on tiger. most other stuff work, and minicom works fine in linux (ubuntu)
11:11 < pixelfairy> (on the same laptop)
11:11 < akh> Tiger != linux
11:11 < pixelfairy> akh: im aware of that
11:11 < pixelfairy> i just said that to confirm that the hardware works
11:11 < akh> I thought you were.  ;-) 
11:11 < akh> We do occasionally have to remind people, though.
11:12 < pixelfairy> i do kinda make osx look like linux
11:12 < pixelfairy> since i run the x server in full screen
11:12 < pixelfairy> and alot of apps remotely
11:12 < cirdan> heh
11:12 < cirdan> whats wrong with minicom
11:12 < pixelfairy> but thats out of lazyness
11:12 < cirdan> i havent used it in a long while
11:12 < pixelfairy> refuses to run
11:12 < pixelfairy> ill try again
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11:14 < das_> http://img172.echo.cx/img172/338/phone17vd.jpg
11:14 < ralfWORK> A
11:14 < pixelfairy> the terminal just hangs
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11:14 < pixelfairy> when you try to run minicom -s
11:14 < pixelfairy> otherwise it complains about no default config
11:15 < pixelfairy> running as root does the same thing
11:15 < pixelfairy> it also eats the cpu
11:15 < pogma> how long have you waited?
11:16 < pixelfairy> about a minute
11:16 < pixelfairy> ill take any serial console program
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11:16 < pogma> hmm, do me a favor? wait 15 minutes
11:16 < pixelfairy> just seems silly to boot to linux just for that
11:16 < akh> pogma:  dlsym?
11:16 < pogma> akh: wild guess
11:17 < akh> good as any.
11:17 < pogma> don't know anything about minicom, but eating cpu and just sitting there are the right symptoms
11:20 < cirdan> pogma: i
11:20 < cirdan> 'll build it i guess and take a quick look :-)
11:21 < pixelfairy> know of anything else for a serial console?
11:21 < cirdan> no
11:21 < cirdan> i had to port minicom becasue there was nothing else :-)
11:21 < cirdan> this was long ago though
11:21 < pixelfairy> teehee!
11:21 < pogma> pixelfairy: well, if it starts eventually, then just don't quit it
11:21 < pixelfairy> thanks
11:21 < pixelfairy> yey for screen...
11:21 < pogma> if it is the dlsym thing then it is fixed in 10.4.2
11:22 < pixelfairy> i thought i had the latest updates
11:22 < cirdan> i guess all packages that have the dlsym bug should depend on darwin8 >= 8.2
11:22 < pixelfairy> guess i dont
11:22 < pixelfairy> Darwin Kernel Version 8.1.0
11:22 < pogma> pixelfairy: it is not released yet
11:23 < pogma> been "coming soon" for quite a while
11:23 < pixelfairy> teehee!
11:24 -!- zizban [~zizban@24-52-0-219.sbtnvt.adelphia.net] has joined #fink
11:24 < akh> pogma:  Maybe there's time to fix the DLYD_LIBRARY_FALLBACK thing...
11:24 < cirdan> heh
11:24 < cirdan> maybe
11:24 < cirdan> pfft.
11:24 < akh> I won't hold my breath.
11:25 < cirdan> aww...
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11:25 < pogma> really, unless you want to die holding your breath on that is not a good plan
11:25 < akh> Nope.  ;-)
11:26 < zizban> heh
11:26 < pixelfairy> if im lucky theyll fix whatever makes xwd only see the root window
11:27 < pogma> most apple bugs only get fixed in the next major release
11:27 < pogma> i.e. 10.5
11:27 < akh> And new bugs are generated at the same time.
11:27 < pogma> and by then there are so many new bugs that you forget about the old ones anyway
11:27 < zizban> the never ending cycle
11:28 < cirdan> pogma: which is why they need better ossw devs working on nit :-)
11:28 < zizban> :)
11:28 < zizban> I'd send my resume but I can barely code perl
11:28 < pogma> yes, well, we all know what happened to my email on that subject
11:28  * akh can't even spell purl
11:28 < akh> ;-)
11:29 < zizban> :)
11:29 < pogma> "we feel your pain"
11:29 < pixelfairy> thats pearl!
11:29 < cirdan> they do? since when? :-)
11:29 < cirdan> whee, 3 mins batter left!
11:31 < cirdan> umm
11:31 < cirdan> minicom works fine here, as -s
11:31 < cirdan> minicom -s
11:31 < cirdan> other than there being no /dev/tty.modem
11:32 < pixelfairy> i think its been about 15 minutes now
11:32 < cirdan> pixelfairy: i have no probs with minicom, other than it can't open /dev/tty.modem
11:32 < pixelfairy> i have a keyspan adapter
11:32 < pixelfairy> but i dont know what device it makes
11:33 < pogma> pixelfairy: can you attach to the process with gdb?
11:33 < cirdan> /dev.tty something
11:34 < pixelfairy> me look
11:35 < pixelfairy> no man page
11:35 < pixelfairy> so how do you do it?
11:36 < pogma> ps -auxww | grep minicom
11:36 < pogma> then gdb attach <first number you see in above output>
11:36 < pixelfairy> in
11:36 < pixelfairy> ps x
11:36 < pixelfairy> is enough
11:37 < pixelfairy> so what now
11:37 < pogma> bt
11:37 < pogma> and lisppsate the result
11:37 < pogma> then 'quit'
11:37 < pixelfairy> lisppate the result?
11:38 < cirdan> !lisppaste
11:38 < pogma> lisppaste: yrl?
11:38 < cirdan> Melian: test
11:38 < Melian> cirdan: i haven't a clue
11:38 < pogma> lisppaste: url?
11:38 < lisppaste> To use the lisppaste bot, visit http://paste.lisp.org/new/fink and enter your paste.
11:38 -!- Melian [~blootbot@pcp04356153pcs.glstrt01.nj.comcast.net] has quit ["adios amigos"]
11:38 < pogma> Melian died
11:38 < cirdan> yes, i told her to
11:38 -!- Melian [~blootbot@pcp04356153pcs.glstrt01.nj.comcast.net] has joined #fink
11:39 < zizban> she's back
11:41 < cirdan> wtf...
11:41 < cirdan> minicom says it can't open any serial ports
11:41 < cirdan> grr
11:41 < lisppaste> pixelfairy pasted "untitled" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/9500
11:43 < pogma> that's strange
11:43 < pogma> your program is hanging in getenv() ???
11:43 < pogma> total oddness :)
11:43 < cirdan> told ya it's not the dlsym :-)
11:44 < cirdan> pixelfairy: how are you calling minicom?
11:44 < pixelfairy> minicom -s
11:44 < pixelfairy> as root
11:44 < cirdan> weird
11:44 < cirdan> i have no problems with it
11:44 < cirdan> pogma: any idea how i can debug "minicom: cannot open /dev/tty.Bluetooth-Modem: No such file or directory
11:45 < cirdan> which in fact does exist
11:45 < pixelfairy> getenv? parses envp?
11:45 < pixelfairy> whats with the lack of man pages?
11:46 < cirdan> lack of manpages for what?
11:46 < cirdan> minicom has them
11:46 < pixelfairy> aparantly for anything
11:46 < pixelfairy> pixel$ man ls
11:46 < pixelfairy> No manual entry for ls
11:46 < cirdan> your system is screwd up then
11:46 < cirdan> or your account, at least
11:47 < pixelfairy> somehow /usr/share/man was not in my manpath
11:48 < cirdan> pixelfairy: type set | less
11:48 < cirdan> and see if anything looks real screwd up
11:48 < cirdan> i gg, bbl
11:49 < pixelfairy> most of it looks ok
11:49 < pixelfairy> only that manpath thing was off
11:49 < pixelfairy> turns out theres a beta keyspan driver
11:51 < cirdan> so? if you have a laptop /dev/tty.modem should work
11:51 < cirdan> and i used the keyspan in 10.1 -> 10.3
11:53 < pixelfairy> there is
12:08  * zizban wonders if installed the new solaris 10 beta release will break his system
12:19 < htodd> are you running on sparc hw?
12:19 < zizban> nay, x86
12:20 < htodd> you're hosed
12:20 < htodd> :)
12:21 < zizban> :)
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12:48 < pHatidic> I juI just installed fink on tiger and immediately ran selfupdate and it is displaying a bunch of stuff, so I'm not sure if it is caught in a loop or not...any insight?
12:48 < pHatidic> wait nevermind
12:48 < pHatidic> i am just impatient
12:48 < zizban> ;)
12:49 < cirdan> heh
12:49 < cirdan> change the verbosity setting
12:51 < pHatidic> hmm so I tried to install ant, and it says "build.xml does not exist!"
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12:56 < pHatidic> heh gimp doesn't work either
12:57 < pixelfairy> pHatidic: gimp.app (which i think was built from fink, then self contained) works fine
12:58 < pHatidic> Alex-Krupps-Computer:~ alexkrupp$ gimp
12:58 < pHatidic> Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display: 
12:58 < zizban> start X11
12:58 < pHatidic> ah ok
12:59 < zizban> gimp.app simply starts X11 along with the gimp
13:00 < pixelfairy> its also a newer version
13:00 < pHatidic> ahh ok
13:00 < pHatidic> does ant work?
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13:16 < newmanbe> !alicekil FAT file system
13:26 < cirdan> newmanbe: you suck :-)
13:26 -!- TheSin [~TheSin@iphost-64-56-130-194.edm.wiband.net] has joined #fink
13:26 < cirdan> hey thesin
13:26 < TheSin> yellow
13:27 < zizban> apt-get install siesta
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13:27 < cirdan> haha
13:28 -!- dmacks [~dmacks@203-137.dialup.cloud9.net] has joined #fink
13:28 < cirdan> Password:
13:28 < dmacks> 1 2 3 4 5
13:28 < robilad> *****
13:28 < cirdan> That's amazing! that's the same combination I have on my luggage!
13:28 < dmacks> !seen Megamaid
13:28 < Melian> dmacks: i haven't seen 'megamaid'
13:29  * robilad curses printing on tiger
13:29 < cirdan> ?
13:29 < dmacks> !seen cirdan
13:29 < Melian> cirdan is currently on #ispman #fink #evms #gift #debian-bots #gift-fasttrack #vcddb.  Has said a total of 29 messages.  Is idling for 0s
13:29 < cirdan> i like cups, i never had a problem with it
13:29 < dmacks> (just checking...her brane was dead last eve)
13:29 < cirdan> yeah
13:29 < robilad> it works okish now, save that sometimes the osx boxes leave out fonts
13:30 < cirdan> anyone here know perl and dbi?
13:30 < robilad> so all i get in printouts is [][][][][
13:30 < cirdan> dmacks: ?
13:30 < cirdan> :-)
13:30 < dmacks> Not so much...perl yes, sql yes, but I rarely put them together.
13:30 < cirdan> hmm
13:31 < cirdan> melian *almost* supports postgres...but i have no knowlege in that subject to make sure all the code is there
13:31 < Melian> cirdan: that's too long
13:31 < dmacks> Melian: That almost made sense, too.
13:31 < Melian> dmacks: i haven't a clue
13:31 < cirdan> if someone else does i can then dump mysql :-)
13:31 < cirdan> !bot snack
13:31 < Melian> :), cirdan
13:33 -!- TheSin [~TheSin@iphost-64-56-130-194.edm.wiband.net] has quit ["Client exiting"]
13:33 < dmacks> If an upstream responds to a bug report with essentially "screw off, it works for normal people; who cares if it's broken when trying to build packages (on all package-building systems) and I misuse standard autoconf flags?", how rude a note should I put in the DescPort when I fix it?
13:34 -!- Fang [~Fang@2002:53cd:25d8:1:0:0:0:1] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
13:34 < akh> Obscenity is called for.  ;-)
13:34 < htodd> a) I don't believe dmacks is up this early
13:34 < htodd> 2) bad, offensive language is OK for htis case
13:34 < akh> Maybe he's up late.
13:35 < htodd> iii) you also know that the only people who see the bad language are going to report it as a bug
13:35 < akh> four)  What package?
13:35  * dmacks set up a 12-hour reaction at 2am that took up my entire workspace, so went home early:)
13:36 < cirdan> nice
13:36 < cirdan> :-)
13:36 < akh> That'd do it.
13:36 < dmacks> akh: pi) pygtk2-pyXX
13:36 < cirdan> dmacks: my uncle used to do sims in pascal that took 2-7 days to run :-)
13:36 < cirdan> physics/EE
13:36 < htodd> I've done chip simulations that took a day
13:36 < akh> cirdan:  Just like a KDE build.
13:37 < htodd> actually just circuit simulations
13:37 < dmacks> akh: ha!
13:37 < cirdan> mac SE, 512k RAM, 20M drive
13:37 < cirdan> woot!
13:37  * cirdan remembers fondly the days
13:37 < dmacks> my grad school molecular calcs regularly took several weeks
13:38 < cirdan> but i hated it cause i couldn't use his computer all weekend :-)
13:38  * cirdan now has a mac SE with 4M ram and a much larger HD
13:38  * htodd still has his SE/30
13:38 < cirdan> 16MHz! yay
13:39 < cirdan> htodd: i got this one from my college
13:39 < dmacks> 5 years later, someone published some "actual" studies showing that what we were expecting to determine by said calcs (but never did) wasn't true in the Real World either.
13:39 < cirdan> and i heard Drexel stamped macs are worth more to collectors
13:39 < cirdan> dmacks: hehe
13:39 < akh> dmacks: it never is.
13:40  * akh takes simulation results with a whole bag o' salt.
13:41 < dmacks> Technically, the simulation was a success I guess?
13:42 -!- emp [~emp@70.57.239.38] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)]
13:42 -!- emp__ [~emp@70.57.239.37] has joined #fink
13:43 < dmacks> It failed to find a solution because any of [buggy Fortran, bad input data, bad SWAG for interaction coefs, there really is no solution], and we now know that the last is true.
13:43 < dmacks> Hrm I guess that doesn't mean the first three weren't also true:(
13:44 -!- akh_laptop [~akhansen@jove.psfc.mit.edu] has joined #fink
13:46  * akh_laptop just noticed that newmanbe hasn't changed the topic in his URL-altering madness.
13:46  * newmanbe wasn't aware he could change the topic.
13:46 < dmacks> "sf" saves chars:)
13:46 < cirdan> heh
13:47 < akh_laptop> good point.  
13:47 < cirdan> you can''t unless u are an op
13:47 < cirdan> i think
13:47 -!- akh [~akhansen@ldx3.psfc.mit.edu] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
13:47 < newmanbe> I think this channel has topic lock on.
13:47 < cirdan> /mode chan +t
13:47 < dmacks> newmanbe: Go like this "so enough about computers, anyone see the game last night?"
13:47 < cirdan> right
13:47 < newmanbe> Game...
13:47 < newmanbe> Oh, Bush's speech?
13:48 < dmacks> heh. See? Now we're onto a different topic.
13:48 < newmanbe> Hehehe.
13:48 < cirdan> !lart dmacks
13:48  * Melian plops dmacks into a giant vat of herring
13:48 < cirdan> new topic
13:48 < cirdan> ;-)
13:49 < akh_laptop> dmacks: don't get me started about the game.
13:49 < dmacks> q
13:49 -!- dmacks [~dmacks@dmacks.active.supporter.pdpc] has quit ["leaving"]
13:50  * akh_laptop is still bitter that my train didn't get home until after midnight because we were waiting at Fenway Park for 20 minutes.
13:51  * newmanbe changes the topic at fink@conference.jabber.org to use http://www.finkproject.org/ .
13:52 < akh_laptop> heh
13:52 -!- akh_laptop is now known as akh
13:57 -!- vasi [~vasi@modemcable214.145-70-69.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #fink
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14:03 -!- cmeme [~cmeme@216.184.11.2] has joined #fink
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14:33 -!- Albie [~ambs@bl5-165-229.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #fink
14:47 < akh> vasi: looked at Martin's email.
14:47 < vasi> yes
14:47 < vasi> i just sent a reply
14:47 < akh> Saw that too.
14:47 < akh> Bug #1 seems pretty robust:  I get that all the time.
14:47 < vasi> yeah...i tried to look into it, but still can't repro
14:48 < vasi> i did solve another bug while i was at it though :-)
14:48 < akh> Cool.
14:48 < vasi> specificially 'apt-get upgrade' *ALWAYS* wants to upgrade gcc3.1 on Tiger
14:48 < akh> Unless you flush the old XCode first, of course.
14:49  * akh experienced that one for myself.
14:49 < vasi> ah ok, well anyhow for those of us who didn't, that will now be fixed
14:49 < akh> Sounds good.
14:49 < cirdan> akh: we need to make ppl flush devtools...
14:50 < akh> It's suggested now on the main page upgrade instructions.
14:50 < akh> Wait, no it's not.
14:51 < akh> shit:  somebody broke the docs.
14:52 < vasi> wasn't mE1
14:52 < akh> We lost the links to OS < 10.4 installers.
14:53 < cirdan> akh: or, you never added it...
14:53 < cirdan> :)
14:53 < akh> No, it was there.
14:53  * akh consults the cvs logs
14:54 < cirdan> heh
14:54 < akh> ("it" == alternate installers, not the dev tools purge)
14:54 -!- dmacks [~dmacks@netspace.org] has joined #fink
14:54 < cirdan> hey dmacks 
14:54 < cirdan> oh
14:54 < vasi> hi dmacks
14:54 < dmacks> hiy'all
14:55 < akh> nm:  I was looking at the wrong damn page.
14:55  * akh will add the suggestion to purge the old Developer tools, then.
14:56 < vasi> oh my, updating the docs always scares me
14:57 < cirdan> :-)
14:57 < akh> Eh, it's not so bad.
14:57 < dmacks> Why, it's not like our doc build system is fragile.
14:57 < akh> It's not like anybody reads them--much worse to muck up a package commit.
14:58 -!- gopp [party@ool-44c13de2.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #fink
14:58 < gopp> hey
14:58 < cirdan> hehehe
14:58 < dmacks> No problem there either..."the solution is in the docs"
14:58 < gopp> any here use itunes
14:58 < gopp> why do I need my cc, if podcast are free
14:58 < gopp> it ask me to enter my cc before I could download one
14:59 < vasi> gopp, you're in the wrong channel
14:59 < vasi> i think you need #apple-apologists
14:59 < dmacks> heh
14:59 < cirdan> gopp: well, this is #fink, no #itunes, and you must create an apple itunes account to d/l from them
15:00 < gopp> hmm but I had one for .mac but know it requires a cc
15:00 < gopp> oh well
15:00 < gopp> to create an acount I need a cc
15:00 < gopp> hmm
15:00 < cirdan> i tink u can use the same account as .mac
15:00 < cirdan> just put your account info in
15:01 < cirdan> gopp@mac.com :-)
15:01 < gopp> yepe then it say I must review
15:01 < gopp> oh k
15:01 < gopp> hmmno #itunes
15:01 < gopp> hmm none
15:02 < dmacks> Perhaps #macosx?
15:03 < dmacks> There's an #itunes on asylo, but it appears to be warez/porn swapping so I doubt they will help with a legit use:)
15:03 < cirdan> heh
15:03 < cirdan> asylo?
15:04 < gopp> hmm a cc to use podcast no thanks
15:04 < dmacks> cirdan: It's an irc network.
15:04 < cirdan> gopp: no, it's a cc to use iTMS
15:05 < gopp> k I got it work
15:05 < gopp> wow
15:05 < gopp> this is funny
15:05 < gopp> wow 
15:07 < gopp> k I will bbl
15:13 < akh> Maybe we should change this channel to #fix-dlsym
15:17 < dmacks> Better to make it #dlsym-is-fixed, then we can all leave for a few days/weeks
15:18 < cirdan> hehe
15:18 -!- dk0r [~dk0r@cpe-24-194-167-76.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit []
15:19 < akh> But that would be lying.  ;-)
15:20 < dmacks> Just like the dyld docs do now, leading the this very situation.
15:20 < akh> Ah, yes.
15:21 < cirdan> #honk-for-dlsym
15:22 < akh> ;-)
15:23 < dmacks> !seen drm
15:23 < Melian> drm <~unbacio@81.213.116.41> was last seen on IRC in channel #fink, 4d 3h 52m 56s ago, saying: 'bye'.
15:24 < dmacks> Anyone know if he's got email access?
15:24 < cirdan> err..
15:24 < cirdan> he'll be back later he said
15:24 -!- hennker [flullup@dsl-082-082-236-225.arcor-ip.net] has joined #fink
15:25 < dmacks> Ah
15:33 < vasi> dmacks, what's the problem?
15:34 < lisppaste> vasi pasted "any objection to the following addition to the packaging docs?" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/9508
15:35 -!- dk0r [~dk0r@cpe-24-194-167-76.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #fink
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15:36 < akh> Looks fine to me.
15:40 < vasi> cool
15:41 < vasi> now to remember how to commit this stuff
15:42 < akh> Doc stuff?
15:49 < vasi> yeah, i only end up changing docs every few months, so i keep having to re-read the commit procedure
15:52  * akh needs to modify the "multilingual" document to mention the option just to make a single language at a time.
15:52 < akh> (make LANGUAGES=en), say.
15:58 < vasi> confused about file packaging.zh.html -- ignoring
15:59 < vasi> did i screw up?
16:01 < vasi> akh: ping?
16:01 < akh> vasi:  no problem
16:01 < vasi> ok, just making sure
16:04 < dmacks> vasi: I wanted to ask him what's going on with the CVS branching in scripts/installer
16:06 < dmacks> There's a branch_10_3 but no branch_10.4, for example.
16:07  * dmacks gets confused when files I delete in HEAD reappear later in various branches...want to make sure we have a plan 
16:08 < dmacks> "a branch for each OS, develop in HEAD, can start using head instead of branch later" vs "use HEAD, just tag each release" vs "umm...whatever"
16:08 < akh> ah
16:18 < akh> awww-can't check out the gcc3.1 detection from HEAD.
16:25 < vasi> akh, how come?
16:26 < dmacks> vasi: Why is var/lib/fink/path-prefix-g++-* created on-the-fly instead of as part of fink's .deb?
16:27 < vasi> dmacks, there's a reason but i forget :-)
16:27 < vasi> check the logs?
16:27 < dmacks> Appears it was originally in .deb, then changed, but I don't see a reason.
16:27 < akh> vasi:  I don't have an available gcc3.1-enabled XCode.
16:27 < vasi> akh, oh i thought you meant 'check out' in the cvs sense
16:28 < akh> oops--imprecision on my part.
16:28 < vasi> dmacks, i mean the #fink logs
16:28 < dmacks> Oh.
16:29 < dmacks> [will do it later, and ask later if I'm still confuzzled]
16:29 < Murr> grrr
16:29 < Murr> I ran into libJPEG hell
16:30 < vasi> dmacks, reading the logs i come up with this:
16:30 < vasi> 1. if path-prefix is in .deb, and somebody ever deletes their path-prefix, it becomes impossible for them to build a new fink
16:30 < vasi> 2. bootstrap!
16:33 -!- jtyler [~jtyler@iphost-64-56-130-194.edm.wiband.net] has joined #fink
16:33 < vasi> oh crap, i forgot to ./update.sh the fink site
16:33 < cirdan> heh
16:33 < cirdan> oops
16:34 < cirdan> !punish vasi 
16:34 -!- hennker [flullup@dsl-082-082-236-225.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: 148 (No route to host)]
16:34 < cirdan> !test
16:34 < Melian> Yes, cirdan, you're still online.
16:40 < vasi> is there any reason we don't have a system-python?
16:40 < cirdan> it's not all there
16:41 < cirdan> it's not a full python and -dev install
16:44 < vasi> oh really? that sucks
16:44 < dmacks> vasi: Yeah. That's why we started supplying pythonXX for system's XX.
16:45 < dmacks> Seems better to have path-prefix in .deb, and then also verify it's still there at build-time if that's the problem.
16:45 < vasi> cuz i've been thinking of reactivating Nicotine.app, but having to include all of python2x is a pain
16:46 < vasi> dmacks, if you'd like that to happen, go ahead :-)
16:46 < vasi> as long as it continues to work in those two cases
16:46 < dmacks> :)
16:46 < dmacks> It's confusing as hell to have static files not be in the dlocate db.
16:46 < cirdan> hehe
16:47 < dmacks> vasi: Is Nic just a python script or are there module files also?
16:47 < dmacks> (either external or as part of the pkg itself)
16:47 < vasi> it needs pygtk :-/
16:47 < dmacks> heh. Well then you're already pulling python2x anyway:)
16:48 < vasi> er, i don't care about having python2x on my computer...but when i'm distributing a .app, it's nice if a 20-something MB runtime doesn't have to be included
16:49 < dmacks> I think system's python is suffient to run stuff, just not to compile .so
16:51 < vasi> hmm, i'll see what fun i can cause
16:51 -!- Albie [~ambs@bl5-165-229.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit ["Leaving"]
16:52 -!- xhrl [~ThomasW@24.80.39.250] has joined #fink
16:52 < dmacks> (and .py[co] wouldn't be portable 2.x->2.y, but if user has "wrong" python they just get rebuilt on-the-fly anyway)
16:53  * dmacks thought you were talkin' fink fun, not stand-alone .app fun:)
17:02 -!- dalibor [~Topic@p54A55A67.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #fink
17:09 < dmacks> akh: your aquafail log has "** BUILD FAILED **" due to a missing aquaterm/AQTAdapter.h
17:09 < akh> Yup.
17:10 < akh> I knew that, but AQTAdapter.h does exist elsewhere in the tarball.
17:10  * dmacks is building on XCode-1.5 to compare
17:12 < gopp> what new with fink
17:12 < gopp> will fink support x86
17:12  * dalibor pokes pogma
17:13 < akh> meh--thought I could apt-get it.
17:13 < akh> Stupid license.
17:14 < akh> Wait a damn minute--it's not Restrictive.
17:15 < dmacks> Wow, the buildlog is entirely different.
17:15 < cirdan> heh
17:15 < akh> Stupid Xcode.
17:17 < dmacks> akh: the .deb is in the bindist for both 10.3 and 10.4T.
17:17 < akh> Yeah--wrong version.
17:17 < dmacks> ...for0.3.0a-5
17:17 < akh> !lart me
17:17  * Melian takes out akh with the trash
17:17 < cirdan> heh
17:17 < dmacks> Should be ~/.Trash Shirley?
17:17 < akh> I stand by my "Stupid Xcode"
17:17 -!- dk0r [~dk0r@cpe-24-194-167-76.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #fink
17:18 < akh> It seems like .app builds get fscked up every upgrade.
17:18 < dmacks> dmalloc_MIA: your tcpreplay Source is busted.
17:18 -!- Feanor [~astrange@feanor.developer.opendarwin] has quit []
17:19 < cirdan> hehe
17:19 < dmacks> Apparently apple also made some "changes that impact certain features and functionalities" in PackageMaker too.
17:19 < akh> bastards
17:21 -!- dmacks is now known as dmacks_away
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17:54 -!- You're now known as RangerAway
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18:17 < josh__> anybody have instructions for Fink on x86-based Macs?
18:20 < htodd> 1) buy me an x86 mac to have me check it
18:20 < htodd> 2) get patches from me
18:21 < htodd> 3) profit!
18:22  * dalibor wonders wheter x86-tiger runs in qemu
18:22 < josh__> I'm having trouble checking out the source with cvs
18:23 < josh__> I'd be happy to submit patches once I can check it out
18:23 < josh__> cvs -d:pserver:anonymous@cvs.sourceforge.net:/cvsroot/fink 
18:23 < josh__> doesn't work
18:25 < newmanbe> Sigh, all the Ferengi wanting nothing more than profit.
18:27 < vasi> josh__, in what way does it not work?
18:27 < josh__> I got those instructions from
18:27 < josh__> http://sourceforge.net/cvs/?group_id=17203
18:27 < josh__> if I use that, cvs dumps the usage info
18:27 < newmanbe> !alicekill SourceForge.net
18:27  * Melian I want to kill SourceForge.net, I mean, I wanna, I wanna kill SourceForge.net. Kill. I wanna see SourceForge.net's blood and gore and guts and have SourceForge.net's veins in my teeth.  Eat SourceForge.net's dead burnt body.  I mean kill, Kill, KILL, KILL.  and I jump around with newmanbe, yelling "KILL, KILL"
18:28 < newmanbe> Melian: You should not use /me with alicekill
18:28 < Melian> newmanbe: I give up, what is it?
18:28 < newmanbe> cirdan: Fix that.
18:28 < vasi> did you possibly forget the 'login' or 'co' part
18:28 -!- pixelfairy [~pixel@dsl081-036-140.lax1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has left #fink []
18:28 < josh__> the instructions say nothing about that
18:28 < vasi> josh, uh?
18:28 < vasi> from that page, "cvs -d:pserver:anonymous@cvs.sourceforge.net:/cvsroot/fink login"
18:29 < josh__> arg - my browser wrapped login to the next line so it looks like a separate command
18:30 < josh__> I feel silly since I use cvs all the time
18:30 < vasi> s'ok, honest mistake
18:30 < josh__> and web browser for that matter (hell, I work on a web browser)
18:30 < pogma> morning
18:31 < dalibor> hey pogma !
18:31 < vasi> evening
18:31 -!- jtyler [~jtyler@iphost-64-56-130-194.edm.wiband.net] has quit ["Leaving"]
18:32 < vasi> pogma, do you know if anything can be done to expand the load commands segment of a Mach-O executable or library?
18:32 < vasi> (either at runtime or link time)
18:32 < pogma> link time you can use -headerpad-max-install-names
18:32 < pogma> or whatever that is
18:33 < vasi> cool, thanks pogma
18:33 -!- josh__ is now known as josh_mf
18:33 < pogma> -headerpad_max_install_names
18:33 < pogma> underscores, not -
18:34 < vasi> yeah, i just read man ld
18:34 < vasi> runtime, ain't nothing can be done, eh?
18:34 < pogma> there is usually enough room to change some install names if not objective c
18:34 < vasi> yeah, but not always enough :-(
18:35 < vasi> i could always build with a really long %p :-)
18:35 < vasi> er wait, i actually do have a %p sitting around that's really long, i'll use that
18:38 < vasi> damn, can't use that, i'll do the LDFLAGS munging instead
18:38 < vasi> thanks pogma
18:52 -!- baba [~baba@YahooBB220041001026.bbtec.net] has joined #fink
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18:55 -!- dmacks_away is now known as dmacks
18:59 < vasi> !seen msachs
18:59 < Melian> msachs <~matthewg@A17-201-27-175.apple.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #fink, 5d 12m 12s ago, saying: 'Damn their scurvy hides.'.
18:59 < vasi> hmm, msachs has been hiding
18:59  * newmanbe could have sworn he's been here since then.
19:00 < pogma> he's on aim
19:00 < newmanbe> CVS activity on the 24th.
19:00 < vasi> AIM id?
19:01 -!- xhrl [~ThomasW@24.80.39.250] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
19:01 < vasi> MattSachs, nm
19:05 < pogma> vasi: Does bootstrap work on darwin/x86 with HEAD?
19:05 < vasi> i don't know, talking with josh atm
19:05 < vasi> ask bbraun if he's around?
19:07 < pogma> there was an issue with BootStrap.pm that I think I fixed
19:07 < vasi> details?
19:07 < pogma> we check all kinds of crap and it didn't recognize i386-apple-darwin8 as needing the 10.4 tree
19:08 < vasi> that sounds possible
19:11 < josh_mf> I'm doing a bootstrap right now, it appears to be working
19:11 < pogma> you don't wantfink to build multi-arch binaries, right?
19:11 < josh_mf> it says 10.4-transitional was detected
19:11 < josh_mf> no no - I just want x86
19:12 < pogma> good :-)
19:12 < josh_mf> maybe transitional later, but at this point I definitely don't care
19:13 < Murr> !seen Murr
19:13 < Melian> murr is currently on #fink (6h 21m 22s).  Has said a total of 3 messages.  Is idling for 0s
19:14 < vasi> multi-arch we expect to be much harder
19:14 < josh_mf> everything appears to be fine with fink
19:14 < vasi> :-)
19:15 < newmanbe> josh_mf: Of course it is fine.
19:16 < josh_mf> never mind - bustage
19:16 < vasi> ack, where?
19:16 < josh_mf> In file included from dump.c:37:
19:17 < vasi> !lisppaste
19:17 < Melian> it has been said that lisppaste is a bot that lets you post large chunks of text without flooding the channel. Use it at http://paste.lisp.org/new/fink
19:17 < vasi> if it's long, use that :-)
19:17 < lisppaste> josh_mf pasted "x86 build bustage" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/9517
19:18 < vasi> ah oops, that's a known bug on PPC too
19:19 < vasi> *sigh* i should probably work on making a new dpkg-boostrap anyhow
19:19 < josh_mf> is there an easy way around it for now?
19:20 < pogma> isn't that fixed in unstable?
19:21 < vasi> pogma, yes
19:21 < vasi> but moving unstable => dpkg-bootstrap isn't just a copy
19:21 < josh_mf> so how do I check out your unstable stuff so I can get this limping?
19:21 < pogma> so josh_mf could copy the dpkg patch over?
19:21 < vasi> probably the patch
19:21 < vasi> lemme diff them
19:22 < josh_mf> I'm happy to delete stuff and check it out, start over
19:22 < josh_mf> I haven't really gotten anywhere yet anyway
19:22 < pogma> daughter says "you're smelly daddy" ... /me goes to have a shower :)
19:22 -!- pHatidic [~Snak@ool-43562074.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #fink
19:22 < vasi> lol
19:22 < vasi> josh, yeah you can copy over the patch
19:23 < dmacks> pogma: it's faster to clothes-pin her nose...
19:23 < pHatidic> so is it possible to install Ant in fink on 10.4? I tried and it gives me an error
19:23 < dmacks> Or teach her the pleasures wrought by naso-cranial crayon insertion.
19:24 < vasi> er, just use http://cvs.sourceforge.net/viewcvs.py/fink/dists/10.4-transitional/unstable/main/finkinfo/base/dpkg.patch
19:24 < pHatidic> to do that do I just do "fink selfupdate" and choose CVS?
19:25 < josh_mf> which one of those do I select for diffs?
19:25 < vasi> sorry, that was to josh
19:25 < pHatidic> oh
19:25 < vasi> josh, just download the current version and stuff it in fink/10.4-transitional
19:25 < vasi> then start bootstrap up again
19:25 < vasi> pHatidic, can you show us the error?
19:25 < vasi> !lisppaste
19:25 < Melian> lisppaste is a bot that lets you post large chunks of text without flooding the channel. Use it at http://paste.lisp.org/new/fink
19:25 < vasi> use lisppaste :-)
19:26  * newmanbe notices new-found certainty found through the use of <REPLY>.
19:26 < pHatidic> visi, it installs successfully, but then when I type "ant" at the command line it gives me "Buildfile: build.xml does not exist!"
19:27 < josh_mf> so do I replace the dpkg.patch that is already there?
19:27 < vasi> yes
19:27 < vasi> pHatidic, that's normal :-)
19:27 < vasi> you need a build.xml to use ant, it's like a Makefile
19:28 < pHatidic> how do I get a build.xml?
19:29 < vasi> you write one yourself i think 
19:29 < vasi> i bet there's a channel of Ant people that can help you better than i can
19:29  * newmanbe demands dmacks make http://www.gnome.org/ work again.
19:29 < newmanbe> Haha, ant people.
19:30 < dmacks> Yeah, they live on ant farms.
19:31 < newmanbe> You'd think they'd have a machine to tell you where everything went.
19:31 < vasi> http://cvs.gnome.org/
19:31 < vasi> like that?
19:32 < newmanbe> Yes.
19:32 -!- zizban [~chris@24-52-0-219.sbtnvt.adelphia.net] has joined #fink
19:33  * dmacks wonders whether #ant would be of use...
19:33 < pHatidic> dmacks there is only one person there
19:33 < zizban> #aunty-em
19:33 < cirdan> dmacks, vasi anyone look at my branch yet?
19:34 < cirdan> i have a bunch of stuff in it for darwin
19:34 < vasi> sorry cirdan :-(
19:34 < vasi> for darwin?
19:34 < dmacks> zizban: that's where you go after building bittornado
19:34 < cirdan> associating dareinX -> 10.y
19:35 < cirdan> vasi: it shou;d be workingfine, i did some testing and bug squashing when i finally maade the 10.3-> 10.4 trasition
19:35 < zizban> dmacks: :)
19:35 < cirdan> just needs some prompts for things like purging the dev tools and asking about a selfupdate
19:35 < vasi> cirdan, ah
19:35 < josh_mf> foiled again
19:35 < vasi> uh oh
19:35 < cirdan> and hopefully patched into real_install and not unpack phase :-)
19:36 < lisppaste> josh_mf pasted "foiled again" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/9518
19:36 < dmacks> cirdan: I haven't looked in a while. If you've got specific things there that are independent of the dist-upgrade thing, may as well work on getting them into HEAD soonish. (in case dist-upgrade isn't the ultimate solution and/or to make it easier to see exactly how it works)
19:36 < cirdan> josh_mf: bbraun has done darwin7 and fink, not much with darwin8 yet
19:36 < vasi> hmm, why does it think the preprocessor is /lib/cpp?
19:36 < pogma> cirdan: bbraun's machine does/did not support darwin8/x86 iirc
19:36 < cirdan> dmacks: there are, but they are semi-intertwined :-/
19:37 < cirdan> pogma: ah, that explains it
19:37 < cirdan> we *really* need darwin in xen/vmware :-)
19:37 < dmacks> Then un-intertwine them, man. Independent stuff should be easy (and preferable) to make independent.
19:37 < cirdan> i'd even help with that, i have a machine that doesn't do a lot normally, except route packets and be NAS ;)
19:38 < cirdan> !seen miket
19:38 < Melian> miket <~miket@pixpat.austin.ibm.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #evms, 6d 1h 45m 40s ago, saying: 'oops!  I will look into this, probably a double free mem'.
19:38 < pogma> need to see comfig.log for that /lib/cpp thing
19:38 < josh_mf> where is that file
19:38 < josh_mf> ?
19:39  * newmanbe wonders what #evms is.
19:39 < vasi> in /sw/src/src.build/libiconv*
19:39 < vasi> or something like that :-)
19:39 < dmacks>  /lib/cpp is a linuxoid location...maybe it's thinging "i86, therefore linux paths" or it always tries that first, or it isn't finding what it should and then falls back to that?
19:39 < vasi> it should be using "gcc -E" instead
19:40 < dmacks> _e_nterprise _v_olume _m_anagement _s_ystem
19:40 < cirdan> hehe
19:40 < cirdan> it rocks
19:40 < cirdan> unless you happen to find a bug :'-(
19:40 -!- njm [~nmisch@69-175-74-212.chvlva.adelphia.net] has left #fink []
19:41 < dmacks> Izzat the equalizer they have on the Star Trek stereo?
19:42 < lisppaste> josh_mf pasted "config.log for foiled again" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/9519
19:43 < vasi> hmm, cannot exec cc1plus?
19:43 < pogma> g++-3.3: installation problem, cannot exec `cc1plus': No such file or directory
19:43 < pogma> eek!
19:44 < vasi> does that mean we'll need 4.0?
19:44 < pogma> Oh, wait, do you have /usr/bin/gcc-3.3 ?
19:44 < pogma> crap, that's correct
19:44 < josh_mf> I have /usr/bin/gcc-3.3
19:44 < pogma> really?
19:44 < vasi> josh, can you do 'find /usr/libexec/gcc -name cc1plus'?
19:45 < pogma> *phew* :)
19:45 < lisppaste> josh_mf pasted "terminal output" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/9520
19:47 < vasi> yeah, looks like we'll need 4.0...
19:47 < vasi> er, you can check if the system has available any install packages for other versions of GCC, that would be useful
19:47 < josh_mf> what do you mean
19:48 -!- Feanor [~astrange@mp1-249-61.dialup.emory.edu] has joined #fink
19:48 < vasi> well with XCode, apple usually allows people to install only certain parts
19:48 < vasi> so you can say "i only want gcc 4"
19:48 < josh_mf> what version of gcc do you want? it has 3.3 and 4 right?
19:49 < vasi> it's possible that they've included a gcc3 installer somewhere
19:49 < vasi> fink currently likes using gcc3.3 for C++ code
19:50 < vasi> if 3.3 isn't an option, then you can force 4.0 by setting the environment variable FINK_NOTRANS before running bootstrap
19:50 < vasi> but i don't know if that really works or what
19:50 < pogma> don't think it does
19:50 < josh_mf> hmm
19:51 < pogma> josh_mf: give us a day or two. I had a bootstrap complete with just gcc-4.0 a couple of months ago
19:51 < josh_mf> I have a lot of work to do porting Firefox, so I'll spend a while figuring this out
19:51 < pogma> josh_mf: so getting back to that point shouldn't be too hard
19:51 < vasi> ok, your other option to force 4.0 is to open PkgVersion.pm
19:51 < cirdan> josh_mf: is there a gcc3.3 installer for darwin x86?
19:52 < josh_mf> according to Apple no
19:52 < josh_mf> but I haven't looked
19:52 < vasi> find where it says ensure_gpp_prefix($vers)
19:52 < josh_mf> I highly doubt it
19:52 < josh_mf> they said all x86 code had to be generated with gcc 4
19:52 < vasi> and a few lines before that, change '3.3' to '4.0'
19:53 < vasi> some packages that enforce 3.3 will still fail, though :-(
19:53 < vasi> you probably want to speak to msachs, i believe he has a complete fink installation using 4.0 only
19:53 < cirdan> josh_mf: gcc4 is required for the fat binary stuff...
19:54 < pogma> vasi: msachs symlinked /usr/bin/g++-3.3 /usr/bin/gcc-3.3 back to gcc4
19:54 < pogma> I think apple will only support gcc4 on intel
19:54 < vasi> pogma, heh....that's another way to do it
19:54 < dmacks> Well that's one way of doing it, and taking advantage of all our "by all means available, force gcc3.3" policy
19:55 < cirdan> hehehe
19:55 < cirdan> he also stripped out the setgcc stuff
19:56 < pogma> darwinsource.opendarwin.org/Roots may have a darwin8 gcc-3.3 binary, but I don't know what it is called
19:57 < pogma> possibly gcc_os-1809.root.tar.gz 
19:58 < pogma> but we really don't want josh_mf installing odd versions of compilers on his machine :/
19:58 < cirdan> pogma: i thought darwin x86 was still built with gcc3.3
19:58 < cirdan> odd that they would use gcc4 for it when tiger can't be built with gcc4
19:59 < vasi> so yeah, i guess the best move is to just symlink the compilers, even though that's kinda sucky
19:59 < josh_mf> so I changed to set 4.0 in PkgVersion.pm
20:00 < josh_mf> will that work as well as symlinking?
20:01 < vasi> josh_mf, not as well...because some packages force gcc3.3 for now :-(
20:01 < josh_mf> some required packages, or just some odd ones out there
20:01 < vasi> uh, i don't have stats on it
20:02 < vasi> a reasonable number, but by no means most
20:02 < vasi> we've been pushing towards less
20:03 < vasi> if you find anything that breaks with gcc symlinked, we can try to fix it
20:03 < josh_mf> ok
20:03 < vasi> it's usually not *horribly* hard to fix, but our priority so far has been getting everything working on Tiger
20:03 < vasi> so if that meant forcing gcc3.3 for now, that's what happened
20:04 < pogma> drm made an odd estimate on -devel that we'd be in a 10.4 tree using just gcc4 by august
20:04 < pogma> drm must've been on drugs :)
20:04 < vasi> hehe
20:05 < vasi> so where's he gone again? Amsterdam? ;-)
20:06 < pogma> on holidays in Turkey
20:06 < dmacks> heh
20:06 < pogma> lots of drugs in Turkey :)
20:06 < dmacks> Even the "certified organic no hormones" ones?
20:06 < cirdan> heh
20:07 < josh_mf> trying again with symlinked gcc-3.3 to gcc-4.0
20:09 < RangerAway> you mean gcc_select, right?  not just hand-editing things?  :)
20:10 < dmacks> gcc4->gcc3.3, not gcc->gcc3.3
20:11 < RangerAway> ick
20:12 < dmacks> (or vice versa...I forget what we're trying to force here)
20:12 < dmacks> But gcc_select certainly ain't it.
20:12 < pogma> gcc_select won't work
20:12 < pogma> we call /usr/bin/gcc-3.3 explicitly
20:17 -!- josh_mf [~josh@covad-mozilla.meer.net] has quit []
20:21 < dmacks> WTF's up with .de-people vs. glib2?
20:21 < dmacks> (glad I left that at Maintainer:gnome-core!)
20:22 < vasi> who people?
20:23 < dmacks> It appears to be some effect of having one's language-locale set to german.
20:24 < cirdan> dmacks: glib2 wont build got me :-)
20:26 < dmacks> ?
20:26 -!- josh__ [~josh@covad-mozilla.meer.net] has joined #fink
20:26 < cirdan> dont have my mac atm
20:26 < cirdan> i think it might be xcode 2.1
20:26 < cirdan> cause Akh built it with 2.0
20:26 < josh__> fails even with symlink
20:27 -!- josh__ is now known as josh_mf
20:29 < josh_mf> I symlinked gcc-3.3 to gcc-4.0
20:29 < josh_mf> you're saying thats not it, dmacks?
20:33 < dmacks> josh_mf: /me was talking to RangerAway
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20:38 < vasi> er, where'd josh go?
20:38 < zizban> far, far away
20:54 < Master_H> does anybody know how to change an alias's icon?
20:57 < vasi> i assume you just copy/paste the icon in Get Info
20:57 < zizban> get info....copy icon then paste onto alias's icon
20:57 < zizban> heh great minds
21:03 < Master_H> thanks
21:03 < zizban> np
21:03 < Master_H> sorry, first mac
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21:10 < zizban> not a problem. welcome
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22:51 < pogma> josh_mf: hi
23:00 < josh_mf> hi
23:04 < pogma> did you get it bootstrapped?
23:05 -!- dk0r [~dk0r@cpe-24-194-167-76.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
23:10 < josh_mf> no
23:12 < pogma> okay, I'm attempting something
23:13 < dmacks> ftp.gnome.org can't saturate my modem connection. Excellent:/
23:31 < pogma> lovin' the bootstrap failures
23:34 < pogma> dmacks: you tried a bootstrap lately?
23:34 < dmacks> Not in a few months. what's up?
23:35 < pogma> fails on gettext, looks like %i is not expanded correctly?
23:36 < dmacks> In HEAD?
23:36 < pogma> let me try one without local modifications :-p
23:36 < pogma> yeah HEAD
23:36 < dmacks> I know vasi_ was working on some changes with it there.
23:36 < vasi_> uh oh
23:36 < dmacks> Perhaps the "we are bootstrapping" flag isn't propagating?
23:37 < vasi_> i bootstrapped successfully pretty recently
23:37 -!- emp__ [~emp@70.57.239.37] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]
23:37 < vasi_> er wait, somebody did report weirdness in gettext...did i fix that?
23:38 -!- emp__ [~emp@70.57.239.38] has joined #fink
23:39 < vasi_> pogma, is this in PHASE TWO or THREE?
23:40 < vasi_> pogma, CVS up
23:41 < vasi_> dmacks, it's because of your chown -R thing
23:41 < dmacks> dang
23:41 < vasi_> you can't use %d in bootstrap, because it's empty (no destdir)
23:42 < vasi_> you have to conditionalize on $self->{_bootstrap}
23:42 < vasi_> i fixed it for msachs a few days back
23:42 < dmacks> We have a _bootstrap flag now?
23:43 < vasi_> we've had a _bootstrap flag for a very very long time, i believe
23:43 < dmacks> Oh right...we just didn't seem to use it IIRC.
23:44 < dmacks> So it's now fixed in HEAD?
23:44 < vasi_> yes
23:45 < dmacks> thx
23:45 < vasi_> we've had _bootstrap and used it since revision 1.6 of PkgVersion.pm
23:45 < vasi_> :-)
23:45  * vasi_ invokes the ghost of chrisp
23:45 -!- vasi_ is now known as vasi
23:46 < dmacks> :)
23:46 < vasi> hmm....anybody know a way to list the fonts that pango thinks exist?
23:46 < pogma> okay, getting lots furthur, thanks vasi
23:46 < vasi> np pogma, thank msachs for finding all our bugs :-)
23:46 < dmacks> Can we move current dpkg to stable?
23:47 < pogma> Oh, that reminds me, did anyone put DYLD_FALLBACK_LIBRARY_PATH=: into basefiles?
23:47 < pogma> dmacks: yes
23:47 < dmacks> pogma: nobody has done that.
23:47 < pogma> 'cause the -ssl bug is not getting fixed anytime soon
23:48 < dmacks> So patch it and release it.
23:48 < vasi> dmacks, do we have a process for moving dpkg -> dpkg-bootstrap?
23:49 < vasi> or do we have to bootstrap-ize it by hand?
23:49 < dmacks> One moment...playing CVS games...
23:49 < vasi> pogma, damn
23:49 < vasi> that's really annoying
23:52 < pogma> makes me wonder just how mush work is involved in patching a project at apple and having it go into a software update, but the reason is that the engineer is buried in bugs
23:53  * dmacks wonders how many others are serious enough and taking enough time that this is back-burnered.
23:53 < vasi> pogma, have you ever tried running bsdiff on anything big? it can practically take days...i'm surprised they can ever release anything as a binary patch
23:54 < dmacks> Seems like many of their patches are just "here's a new copy of the file"
23:55 < dmacks> vasi: The dpkg -> dpkg-bootstrap conversion is a hand-edit.
23:56 < dmacks> And the just-stabilized 1.10.21-217 will need to be tested on a machine that has no exising /sw (to make sure helper-app path hardcoding isn't causing problems)
23:59 < pogma> oops, bootstrap still fails
23:59 < vasi> aww man, where's it fail pogma?
--- Log closed Thu Jun 30 00:00:24 2005