--- Log opened Wed Aug 03 00:00:37 2005
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00:10 < msachs> hey pogma
00:12 < pogma_> hi
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00:14 < msachs> How's it going?
00:14 < pogma> just spent ages installing fedora core 4 :/
00:15 < msachs> Mm, fun.
00:15  * vasi prefers ubuntu
00:16 < pogma> and the silly keyboard has caps-lock where control should be
00:16  * pogma goes to change mapping
00:18 < msachs> Have you ever seen glibtool get confused by the presence of a __.SYMDEF SORTED file in the results of "ar x" ?
00:18 < pogma> heh
00:19 < pogma> Yeah, I fucked up multiple times trying to get fat archive support into libtool
00:19 < pogma> which version?
00:19 < msachs>  /usr/bin/glibtool
00:19 < pogma> ah, blame ed
00:20 < msachs> graphviz (in OS X, not Fink) is building with gcc-5208 (Xcode 2.1), but it's breaking with our latest engineering build.
00:20 < pogma> I think Ed Moy, or Toby Peterson in the BSD group are the responsible people
00:21 < msachs> It looks like...
00:22 < msachs> I dunno, this is weird.
00:22 < msachs> I instrumented glibtool up the wazoo, set -x and lots of echos around all the critical paths...
00:23 < pogma> did they update their glibtool maybe, what is /usr/bin/glibtool --version
00:23 < msachs> And I'm not seeing any diffs until it suddenly decides to -- in one case it tries to do lipo -create /tmp/fat_ar/i386/libcommonconvenience.a/.__SYMDEF, in the other it doesn't.
00:23 < msachs> 1.5 (1.1220)
00:23 < pogma> okay, that's Ed Moy's patch, file a radar
00:24 < msachs> Well, yeah.
00:24 < msachs> The question is exactly what changed in 5216 that breaks things.
00:25 < msachs> I think I'm gonna try regressing this to narrow down what compiler version broke it, try it with 5215...
00:25 < pogma> just the compiler has changed? no new cctools?
00:25 < msachs> Yeah.
00:26 < griff> cool, gtk2 worked, thanks vasi
00:26 < vasi> woot, no prob :-)
00:26 < griff> I wonder how that happened....
00:28 < griff> anyway... if I wanna help out with this perl thing, where on your SF page do I get it and who do I send suggestions to?
00:29 < pogma> +		  # Can't deal with blanks in file names
00:29 < pogma> +		  $run eval "d_files=\`find \$d_dir -type f | sed -e 's,.*/,,' -e '/ /d' | sort -u\`" || exit $?
00:29 < pogma> is that putting __SYMDEF into d_files ?
00:30 < msachs> Okay, but how has what the compiler is feeding into glibtool changed that makes that .__SYMDEF SORTED file get created now?
00:30 < msachs> Yeah.
00:30 < msachs> .__SYMDEF SORTED means ranlib has been run on the archive (with the default -s option, and not the older -o option.)
00:30 < pogma> well, not anymore
00:30 < pogma> ar automagically ranlibs
00:30 < msachs> Right.
00:31 < pogma> unless the output will be fat, iirc, hmm
00:31 < msachs> I ran file on everything in the object root with both builds, everything was fat everywhere.
00:31 < pogma> anyway, can't help you much, sorry. Good luck
00:31 < msachs> Thanks.
00:31 < msachs> I'll need it :)
00:33 < vasi> griff, follow the links for CVS at the bottom-right of fink.sf.net
00:33 < griff> ok
00:33 < griff> that would be a tar file right?
00:33 < vasi> send suggestions to fink-devel, or just ask around on the channel
00:33 < vasi> griff, no
00:33 < vasi> fink is in CVS, a source code management system
00:34 < vasi> so that way if i make a change, but i screw up, i can revert back to the original
00:34 < vasi> or see a log of changes
00:34 < vasi> and such
00:34 < griff> ok
00:34 < griff> i'm in the "cvs view section"
00:34 < griff> is the perl part in the "scripts" folder?
00:35 < vasi> no, in fink
00:35 < griff> ok
00:35 < msachs> pogma: The most suspicious difference I've found so far is that for 5216, "file" reports that the i386 side of the fat archives is "current ar archive random library", whereas for the 5208 build it just says "current ar archive".
00:35 < griff> right
00:36 < griff> what part of fink?
00:37 < vasi> k look, just do this at the terminal: cvs -d:pserver:anonymous@cvs.sourceforge.net:/cvsroot/fink login
00:37 < vasi> just use a blank password, it doesn't matter
00:37 < griff> ok
00:37 < vasi> then 'cvs -d:pserver:anonymous@cvs.sourceforge.net:/cvsroot/fink co fink'
00:37 < griff> ooohhh
00:37 < vasi> that will get you the 'fink' module
00:37 < griff> you just mean get the cvs 
00:38 < vasi> yah
00:38 < griff> ... I thought there was just a text file of the script somewhere I could look at
00:38 < vasi> no, it's in several files
00:38 < vasi> in fink/perlmod/Fink
00:38 < vasi> all those .pm files are our perl modules
00:38 < griff> ok
00:39 < vasi> to make sure your changes compile, use 'make test'
00:39 < vasi> and to actually install a modified fink, use './inject.pl'
00:39 < pogma> wtf does "random library" mean?
00:39 < vasi> lol
00:40 < griff> ok
00:41 < griff> do you know which file is your algorithm for deciding in what order to build dependencies?
00:41 < vasi> that's in Engine.pm, function real_install()
00:41 < vasi> it's a monster function, quite ugly
00:41 < vasi> but the person who wrote the ugly parts isn't part of the project any more, so don't blame us :-)
00:41 < pogma> okay, magic looks for __SYMDEF and appends "random library" if 'tis there
00:41 < griff> :) ok
00:42 < griff> ... cvs -d:pserver:anonymous@cvs.sourceforge.net:/cvsroot/fink co fink 
00:42 < griff> returns:
00:42 < griff> cvs [checkout aborted]: end of file from server (consult above messages if any)
00:42 < griff> (and there aren't any)
00:42 < vasi> pogma, apparently it's a lib that's been run through ranlib (RANdom LIBrary) so it's now RANDOM access
00:43  * vasi learned something today :-)
00:43 < vasi> griff, did you do the login step first?
00:43 < griff> yeah
00:44 < griff> unless changing directories after loging in undoes it somehow
00:44 < griff> well I logged in again and it worked
00:44 < griff> thanks
00:44 < griff> don't expect much...
00:44 < griff> but I'll see what I can see
00:46 < griff> thanks a lot
00:47 < griff> I'm going to bed now, I'll start on perl tomorrow, maybe
00:47 < griff> g'night
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00:48 < pogma> msachs: what env vars fo you have set?
00:49 < msachs> The same ones in both builds.
00:49 < msachs> Which ones do you want to know about?
00:49 < pogma> COMMAND_MODE is unset?
00:49 < msachs> MACOSX_DEPLOYMENT_TARGET is 10.4.
00:49 < msachs> Correct.
00:49 < msachs> At least by me, the build process may set it somewhere.
00:49 < pogma> that was the only thing I could think of, it changes the behavior of ar
00:49 < msachs> Although it doesn't show up in any of my logs.
00:50 < msachs> My spidey sense tells me that the output of file on the two archives differing is where the truffles are, but I'm not quite equipped to dig them up.
00:54 < msachs> Hm, I should go home now.
00:54 < msachs> 'night, folks; pogma
00:54 < pogma> good idea :)
00:54 < pogma> 'night
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01:34  * dmacks hates wiki tables.
01:35 < dmacks> I never thought I'd say "wow, I wish I could write raw-HTML tables...they work so well" :/
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01:53 < AlexF> hio
01:53 -!- AlexF is now known as KB1FYR
01:57 < vasi> dmacks, lol
01:57 < vasi> i think i finally figured it out
01:57 < vasi> how to apply padding to the table so it doesn't all run together
01:57 < vasi> but now it's finally beautiful!
01:57 < vasi> (at least aesthetically, not so beautiful to see all the "needs update" dots)
02:00 < KB1FYR> Woo, kickass. I was gonna ask how to fix the problem with the fink mirrors but I got it. cya..
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02:26 < cirdan> ls
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05:13 < pogma> msachs: Figure it out?
05:13 < msachs> Nope, punted.
05:14 < msachs> How's FC4?
05:15 < pogma> its x11 does not crash as much as apple's :-p
05:15 < msachs> Yeah, but how's it's Display PDF? ;)
05:15 < msachs> *its
05:16 < pogma> don't really care, just wanted a machine that I could leave a few dozen xterms running on
05:16 < pogma> this iMac and X11.app were not it :/
05:17 < msachs> Mm.
05:17 < pogma> So now I got the iMac back :-)
05:17 < msachs> Can't say I've had a problem with Apple's X, but I really only use it for the occasional Gimp.
05:17  * knghtbrd wonders if iTerm has been made to suck a little less than the last version-without-a-new-version-number he downloaded
05:17 < knghtbrd> =p
05:17 < knghtbrd> I try to avoid X11 in all incarnations
05:17 < msachs> Version numbers are so bourgeois.
05:18 < knghtbrd> use it in loonix because there's no alternative  =(
05:18 < msachs> I try to avoid these new-fangled "bitmapped displays" as much as possible.
05:19 < knghtbrd> You prefer vector displays?
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05:19 < knghtbrd> YOUR HEAD A-SPLODE
05:20 < msachs> I've just recently switched to a *glass* teletype.
05:20 < knghtbrd> lol
05:20 < msachs> I wish life were more like sbemail.  I'd just sit there all day holding "tab".
05:21 < knghtbrd> they're getting lazy with the sbemail's
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05:21 < knghtbrd> last several have had nothing in them
05:21 < msachs> Did you forget to install the Flash plugin again, knghtbrd?
05:22 < knghtbrd> um
05:22 < knghtbrd> I meant nothing added
05:23 < knghtbrd> Apple supplied the plugin for me
05:23 < msachs> Oh, yeah.  I did notice that.
05:24 < msachs> Oh yeah, we're cool like that.
05:30 < knghtbrd> There's a new Stinkoman level BTW  =)
05:31 < msachs> Ah, cool.
05:41 < knghtbrd> 39 more emails till StrongBad upgrades to an inkjet.
05:42 < knghtbrd> if only to see if they forget  ;)
05:42 < msachs> Nah, StrongBad is all about lasers.  They're so... laserly.  No, wait, with a 'z'!
05:43 < knghtbrd> accroding to #117, he upgrades to an inkjet in #173  =)
05:43 < msachs> Ah.
05:43 < knghtbrd> (you know that we're both officially dorks for having this conversation...)
05:43 < msachs> Well their Director of Continuity had better get that right, or heads will roll!
05:44 < msachs> Dude, we're hanging out in an IRC channel dedicated to a package manager and porting UNIX software.
05:44 < msachs> Homestar Runner is the least of our worries.
05:45 < knghtbrd> I hack on quake in my spare time
05:45 < knghtbrd> quake 1.
05:46 < msachs> One of my open-source projects is a gateway between IRC and AOL Instant Messenger, so that you can use AIM from an IRC client.
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07:51 < akh_gone> nick akh
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07:51 < akh> D'oh!
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08:52 < pogma> nick akh
08:52 < pogma> nope, doesn't work here either :)
08:52 < akh> heh
08:52 < asari> nick pogma
08:52 < asari> Hi
08:53 < pogma> hi
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09:16  * akh is sooo glad that I'm using a 'swappy-code' enabled version of fink.
09:20 < akh> (that whole gettext-dev vs libgettext3-dev thing)
09:27 < chris01> speaking of libgettext3: could we move this package to the stable trees?
09:28 < akh> Probably--now that the emacs stuff has been split off anyway.
09:29 < pogma> beer time
09:29 < chris01> i would like to move the latest svn to stable. and it now depends on libgettext3
09:29  * chris01 hands pogma two boxes of Feldschlösschen
09:29 < akh> Is that good?
09:29 < chris01> no
09:30 < chris01> but swiss.
09:30 < pogma> iirc nobody decided what to do with libgettext3 and expar for bootstrap
09:30 < pogma> expat
09:30 < pogma> swiss beer must be better than american :-)
09:31 < akh> pogma: ah-forgot about the expat thing
09:31 < chris01> oh no...
09:31 < akh> And the small-brewery US beers can be quite good.  ;-)
09:32 < chris01> www.turbinenbraeu.ch is good
09:32 < chris01> is small too.
09:34 < akh> I like the photos of the brewery.
09:36 < akh> The local brewery I usually buy from is here:  http://www.wachusettbrew.com/index2.htm
09:37 < akh> pogma, chris01:  On the other hand, libgettext3 in stable != making it essential.
09:37 < akh> (i.e. the bootstrap issue isn't there in the former case, righ?)
09:37 < akh> right
09:39 < pogma> akh: I quit core, take it up with someone else :-)
09:40 < akh> Right--I figured that somebody would read the logs later, though. 
09:41 < akh> And I had to point out the obvious.
09:41 < pogma> :)
09:45 < chris01> pogma: lucky you...
09:46 < chris01> akh: yes, I was not talking about making essential, just stable.
09:46 < chris01> I sent an email to fink-core too. But it needs approval there..
09:46 < akh> Ok
09:47 < chris01> akh: can you approve mails on core?
09:47 < akh> yes
09:47 < chris01> ok
09:47 < chris01> akh: could you approve my mail?
09:47 < chris01> :)
09:47 < akh> I'm on  it
09:47 < chris01> thanks
09:48  * akh decide to subscribe to -core w/o getting the mail so that I could post.
09:54 < akh> (decided)
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10:18 < akh> Maybe I should retire and devote my life to a better dependency engine...
10:19 < akh> I guess there's that whole "survival" thing, though...
10:19 < akh> (meaning that my wife would kill me, or at best throw my ass out)
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10:22 < zizban> heh
10:22 < zizban> if she throws your ass out, take your lap top so you can work on the dep engine
10:23 < zizban> why don't you get netbsd's pkgsrc to work on hfs+ drivers, that'll solve the whole dep thing :)
10:24 < zizban> drive
10:24 < zizban> s
10:28 < akh> zizban: I'll get right on that--except that my laptop isn't _my_ laptop.
10:28 < akh> MIT'd repo it.
10:28 < cirdan> puch
10:29 < cirdan> ouch
10:29  * cirdan yawns
10:30 < akh> Though one could probably evaluate dep stuff on a different platform...
10:30 < cirdan> debian ;-)
10:30 < zizban> heh
10:31  * zizban wonder's what blastwave.org uses for a dep engine
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10:53 < akh> good question
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12:01 < MacinMan> how's everyone?
12:02 < MacinMan> has anyone used dia ? i tried it and it just hangs doesn't open any windows
12:04 < zizban> from fink, right?
12:05 < MacinMan> yes
12:05 < MacinMan> it seems like a lot of non aqua native stuff is broekn under tiger
12:06 -!- regeya [~shane@adsl-sp3-cdale176.micgi.com] has joined #fink
12:07 < MacinMan> unless fink is partial to portables
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12:14 < akh> MacinMan:  works for me.
12:14 < MacinMan> akh dia works?
12:14 < akh> yup
12:14 < MacinMan> under tiger with xcode 2.1?
12:14 < akh> yup
12:15 < MacinMan> do you just start it using dia
12:15 < zizban> I personally hate dia
12:15 < MacinMan> that's how i started it\
12:15 < MacinMan> and it didn't do a thing
12:15 < akh> MacinMan  Not even the evp_IDEA error/
12:15 < akh> ?
12:17 < akh> That's odd.
12:17 < MacinMan> did u get my paste?
12:17 < akh> No
12:17 < MacinMan> ok what's the listpaste url
12:17 < MacinMan> i'll paste it there
12:18 < MacinMan> i get a bunch of stuff
12:19 < MacinMan> but alot of what i get is about symbols not being found
12:19 < zizban> !lisppaste
12:19 < Melian> You can use lisppaste to paste errors at http://paste.lisp.org/new/fink , instead of flooding the channel.
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12:20 < akh> Ah--that's probably easy to correct
12:22 < MacinMan> akh well copy and paste is not working between x11 and aqua
12:22 < MacinMan> even with quartz-wm
12:22 < MacinMan> does dia have the same gtk issue as gnome?
12:23 < akh> Yes
12:23 < MacinMan> you left before i resolved my gnome issue the other day
12:23 < MacinMan> gnome loaded but the3 background didn't
12:23 < MacinMan> so i got a blank panel
12:25 < MacinMan> so insktead of the default green desktop with gnome i got the checkered x background and the control panels didn't work
12:27 < akh> That sounds like you started quartz-wm before GNOME.
12:28 < MacinMan> no what i did was i had source /sw/bin/init.sh as the first line in .xinitrc the second line was  what you gave me the third was /sw/bin/gnome-session
12:29 < MacinMan> quartz wm was not loaded
12:29 < MacinMan> at least not to my knowlege
12:29 < akh> hmmm
12:30 < MacinMan> well the line you gave me work for all gtk apps if loaded at x startup
12:31 < zizban> isn't it supposed to be metacity &
12:31 < zizban> exec gnome-session ?
12:32 < akh> zizban: that's for GNOME < 2.4
12:32 < akh> Nothing wrong with trying it, though.
12:32 < zizban> ah
12:32 < zizban> okay
12:32 < akh> Worst case is you get a message saying "a window manager is already running"
12:32 < MacinMan> well on linux the only line is gnome-session
12:32 < MacinMan> i'm assuming to start stuff on x11 is the same
12:32 < akh> MacinMan: there may be an error message in console.log when this happens.
12:32 < MacinMan> ok
12:32 < MacinMan> what was the line i need to put again
12:32 < MacinMan> i'll try it again
12:32 < MacinMan> i accidently cleared my .xinitrc file
12:32 < zizban>  metacity &
12:32 < zizban> exec gnome-session
12:33 < MacinMan> no the one for the expor path
12:33 < MacinMan> for gtk
12:33 < zizban> source /sw/bin/init.sh
12:35 < MacinMan> that one i have i'm looking for the line that fixes the linker
12:35 < MacinMan> when running a gtk app
12:36 < akh> export DYLD_FALLBACK_LIBRARY_PATH=:
12:36 < MacinMan> got it
12:36 < MacinMan> should i put it before the fink source line akh
12:36 < akh> After is probably better.
12:36 -!- dmacks [~dmacks@netspace.org] has joined #fink
12:36 < akh> (I thought we were going to fix this)
12:36 < zizban> me too
12:37 < zizban> maybe that's in 0.24.9 too
12:37 < dmacks> DIE CVS.SF DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE!!!!!!!!!
12:37 < dmacks> <cvs.sf> okay.
12:37 < chris01> people: please test fink-0.24.9 and give (positive) feedback!
12:37 < zizban> only positive? :P
12:37 < chris01> zizban: sure
12:37 < chris01> :)
12:37  * akh will check
12:37 < zizban> heh
12:37 < chris01> according to drm we need 0.24.9 in stable before libgettext3-shlibs can be moved to stable
12:37 < zizban> ya I heard that
12:37 < dmacks> akh: I'm pretty sure pogma fixed the FALLBACK-whatever, but then we never released a new base-files pkg
12:37 < chris01> which means i have to wait for 0.24.9 until i can move svn
12:37 < dmacks> ...that contains the fix.
12:38 < akh> dmacks: ah--maybe that should go on the wiki somewhere.
12:39  * dmacks would check base-files right now, but...see my first comment:/
12:39 < chris01>  we should switch to svn and have it hosted somewhere else than sf
12:40 < zizban> like where?
12:40 < chris01> ähm... like... on your machine, zizban?
12:40 < zizban> (not to be snide)
12:41 < zizban> sure, viva la dynamic IP :)
12:41 < chris01> he. :)
12:41 < dmacks> SF is experimenting with svn. Of course that's a failed solution to resolve a non-problem:)
12:41 < chris01> right
12:41 < zizban> we can ask kernel.org to host it
12:41 < zizban> fink.kernel.org sounds good
12:42 < MacinMan> i'm thinking xorg may work better then appel's x11
12:42 < zizban> with your problem? that wont be the fix
12:42 < dmacks> Yeah, fink.kernel.org will take care of the remaining three people who don't think fink takes over one's whole system.
12:42 < zizban> heh
12:44 < akh> It doesn't????
12:45 < dmacks> For you no, it just deletes the whole system.
12:45 < zizban> heh
12:45 < MacinMan> akh no good with dia i still didn't get it to load even with the fallback statement in .xinitrc
12:46 < MacinMan> and gnome still didn't load right
12:47 < MacinMan> so i gotta figure out why
12:48 < zizban> who is the gnome package maintainer? drm?
12:48 < akh> That's an oxymoron
12:48 < zizban> trfue
12:48 < zizban> true even
12:48 < dmacks> gnome....package maintainer? BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
12:48 < dmacks> You asked, so you win the job.
12:48 < zizban> no way. Back off, junior
12:48 < akh> MacinMan: There may be a missing dependency somewhere--use the Console utility to see if there's a message in console.log about your GNOME startup
12:48 < MacinMan> ok
12:48 < MacinMan> akh i just ran fink selfupdate too
12:48 < zizban> good idea
12:48 < MacinMan> i didn't get fink 0.249 though
12:48 < MacinMan> and i'm using unstable packages
12:48 < akh> It's not released.
12:48 < MacinMan> ahh oki
12:48 < zizban> yepper
12:48 < zizban> when it is, it should fix some bugs, cure hunger and bring world peace
12:49 < zizban> well, one of the three at least
12:49 < akh> mmm...world peace
12:49 < MacinMan> yeah getting a pc and running linux may also solve gtk stuff too
12:49 < akh> Well, yeah, but where's the fun in that?
12:49 < dmacks> Nah...we use .deb, no need for Pacifist.
12:50 < akh> heh
12:50 < zizban> heh
12:50  * akh eagerly awaits the carnage that Shlibs and InheritedBuildDepends will unleash.
12:51 < dmacks> Speaking of curing hunger...bbl
12:51 -!- dmacks [~dmacks@dmacks.active.supporter.pdpc] has quit ["leaving"]
12:51 < zizban> akh: do you want all those bug reports directed to you?
12:51 < MacinMan> akh i recedntly tried fc4 for ppc was a nice distro
12:51 < MacinMan> i'm assuming though even though compiled on ppc linux compiled stuff will not run on os x
12:51  * zizban is still waiting for Solaris to be ported to the ppc
12:52 < zizban> right
12:52 < cirdan> power4 sloaris?
12:52 < zizban> the two aren't binary comptiable
12:52 < zizban> though in theory some could make a Wine-like layer for linux ppc binaries
12:52 < zizban> but really, why would you want to?
12:53 < zizban> cirdan: that too :)
12:53 < akh> zizban:  Just like freetype2 and any prior version of itself.
12:53 < zizban> ah
12:53 < MacinMan> akh i wanted to use sndplay in fink and it won't install
12:53 < akh> Not quite
12:53 < MacinMan> i get a phase installing error
12:53 < MacinMan> and switching gcc versions has no effect
12:53 < MacinMan> it has something to do with a missing file
12:54 < akh> paste the output up when you're able--there's thousands of potential missing files
12:54 < MacinMan> ok
12:54  * akh checks if rebuilding f77 will cure my update woes...
12:55 < MacinMan> f77 sounds like fortran stuff
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12:55 < akh> Exactly like that.  ;-)
12:56 < akh> MacinMan: I got the same error with sndplay.
12:56 < MacinMan> ok akh
12:56 < MacinMan> is it fixable?
12:57 < akh> Probably.
12:57 < MacinMan> anyway akh here is why i need an os x native command line sound playter gaim locks up with esdplay and such and xmms and mplayer aren't suitable
12:57 < MacinMan> so i need a good command line player
12:58 < MacinMan> to pass to gaim
12:58 < akh> ah
12:58 < MacinMan> is there anyway to create a core audio plugin for gaim
12:58 < MacinMan> so it just uses it directly
12:59 < akh> Possibly--or there's xmms-coreaudio
12:59 < MacinMan> akh xmms core audio sucks i tried it
12:59 < MacinMan> all i get is static
13:00 < akh> It worked for me.
13:00 < akh> The sndplay problem looks like a typo.
13:00 < MacinMan> ok
13:01 < MacinMan> akh were u able to play .wav files with xmms coreaudio
13:01 < MacinMan> i was able to do mp3's
13:01 < MacinMan> but gaim uses .wav
13:01 < akh> I don't remember trying .wavs
13:01 < MacinMan> hmm is there a way to start quicktime player by command line
13:01 < MacinMan> it does wavs i know
13:02 < akh> dunno
13:02 < MacinMan> ok
13:04 < akh> I'll try my modification to sndplay and see if it builds...
13:04 < cirdan> launch -a QuickTime\ Player
13:05 < zizban> http://forums.macosxhints.com/archive/index.php/t-26877.html
13:05 < zizban> maybe that will help
13:05 -!- shres [~sshreyas@59.92.143.226] has joined #fink
13:05 < akh> right.  "open" or "launch" will work--as long as .WAV is associated with Quicktime Player.
13:05 < akh> (i.e. open foo.wav)
13:06 < cirdan> esdplay!
13:07 < akh> MacinMan: If you're in a hurry there's a precompiled binary for sndplay.
13:08 < akh> (not in Fink)
13:08 < akh> and my attempt at a fix didn't work.
13:09 < akh> Wonder if the problem is due to XCode version silliness.
13:09 < akh> (xcodebuild in particular)
13:11 < zizban> I wouldn't be surprised
13:14 -!- Albie [~ambs@bl5-163-177.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #fink
13:16 -!- vasi [~vasi@modemcable133.147-70-69.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #fink
13:17 < zizban> or perhaps it's vasi's fault
13:17 < zizban> oh wait, here's here now
13:17 < vasi> ?
13:17 < zizban> it was a joke
13:17 < zizban> akh> and my attempt at a fix didn't work.
13:17 < zizban> 13:10 < akh> Wonder if the problem is due to XCode version silliness.
13:17 < zizban> 13:10 < akh> (xcodebuild in particular)
13:17 < zizban> 13:12 < zizban> I wouldn't be surprised
13:20 -!- zizban [~zizban@24-52-0-219.sbtnvt.adelphia.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
13:20 < pogma> sigh, it should use xcodebuild install DSTROOT=%d or similar
13:20 < vasi> cirdan, are you awake?
13:22 < akh> pogma: Ah
13:25 < pogma> xcodebuild INSTALL_PATH=%p/bin
13:25 < pogma> then
13:26 -!- chris01 [~chris01@212.126.165.246] has quit ["bye"]
13:26 < pogma> zcodebuild INSTALL_PATH=%p/bin DSTROOT=%d
13:26 < pogma> x even
13:39 < das_> export CM_BUILD=CM_BUILD
13:39 < das_> argh
13:39 < das_> Hello pogma.
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14:38 < akh> meh--can't get to the PDB
14:40 < dmacks> sf connectivity is worse than usual today.
14:50 < cirdan> vasi?
14:56 < dmacks> cirdan: You know Melian no longer hears ending question-marks:)
14:56 -!- MacinMan [~tron@user-0c6ss3t.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
14:58 < akh> heh
15:02 -!- shres [~sshreyas@59.92.143.226] has left #fink ["Leaving"]
15:07 < cirdan> !lart Melian 
15:07  * Melian cuts cirdan into thin stripes
15:07 < cirdan> Melian: unstable
15:07 < Melian> i guess unstable is http://www.finkproject.org/faq/usage-fink.php#unstable , or at http://www.finkproject.org/faq/usage-fink.php#bindist
15:07 < cirdan> Melian: unstable?
15:07 < Melian> it has been said that unstable is http://www.finkproject.org/faq/usage-fink.php#unstable , or at http://www.finkproject.org/faq/usage-fink.php#bindist
15:10 < dmacks> Looks like the oo.o doctor needs another consultation:(
15:13 < akh> yup
15:16  * akh referred him to a relevant thread.
15:24 < dmacks> Anyone understand gettext from a user's perspective?
15:29 < Feanor> i think you setenv LANG and everything magically changes languages
15:30 < dmacks> Okay, make that "advanced user's perspective". I want to specify an alternate default location for the dictionaries (then fall back to the standard one if no catalog there).
15:31  * dmacks wants to have 'make test' use the one in the package being built, not the one in an already-installed form of that pkg.
15:32 < dmacks> ...since that one causes a segfault.
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16:00 < drm> !seen vasi
16:00 < Melian> vasi <~vasi@modemcable133.147-70-69.mc.videotron.ca> was last seen on IRC in channel #fink, 2h 39m 58s ago, saying: 'cirdan, are you awake?'.
16:09 -!- Netsplit brown.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: drm, mee_bot, hennker, pnorman, kane-xs, regeya, runelind, gecko2, emp
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16:51 < dmacks> !wb megahal 
16:51 < Melian> Welcome back megahal, o lonely traveller amongst the TCP/IP packets of chaos.
16:52 < drm> that's ok, bots, talk amongst yourselves
16:54 -!- megahal [~netking@70.85.113.106] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
16:59 < akh> heh
16:59 -!- akh is now known as akh_gone
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17:04 < dmacks> Is Info3 in 0.24.9 now? If not, should it be?
17:06 < drm> i think its only in head... not sure that we've finalized what goes into 0.24.9, but as today's exchange with Chris indicated, i'd like to see us release 0.24.9 quite soon (so that it can go to stable)
17:08 < dmacks> I agree. I saw vasi removed "backport Info3 to 0.24" from the TODO list, wasn't sure if it was accomplished or quashed.
17:08 < drm> well, i didn't see it in the commits, but i could've missed it
17:09  * dmacks hasn't been able to access sf since last night.
17:09 < drm> has the issue of removing RFC whatever when Info3 is introduced been resolved?
17:09 -!- Murr [~neeri@A17-202-20-71.apple.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
17:09 < dmacks> (...which gives me an excuse for not fixing anything people find in the new gnome-vfs2:)
17:09 < dmacks> I think it's left as-is...loud warning but still accept it. vasi's patch seems to deal well with it.
17:10 < drm> ok... i thought there would be some major simplification if it was eliminated, though? (wasn't following too closely)
17:10 -!- zizban [~zizban@24-52-0-219.sbtnvt.adelphia.net] has joined #fink
17:11 -!- Murr [~neeri@A17-202-20-71.apple.com] has joined #fink
17:12 < Murr> hmm
17:12 < Murr> are really all of our ssl packages currently broken?
17:12 < drm> in what way?
17:12 < dmacks> Yeah. We've limped along so far not too badly. OTOH, Info3 gives us a cleanish breaking point, so we wouldn't have to keep dragging that baggage around. OT3H it doens't save that much unless we also drop it from other InfoN levels. OTOH, we'd be able to keep extending Info3 without worrying about it.
17:12 < Murr> that programs linking against them crap out at run time
17:13 < Murr> Symbol not found _EVP_idea_cbc
17:13 < drm> i guess i knew about some of that
17:13 < drm> didn't know it affected all of them
17:13 < Murr> well, that's what I'm asking
17:13 < dmacks> FAQ murr.
17:14 < Murr> I saw a mail in the archives which suggested thanks dmacks
17:14 < Murr> is this a similar issue as the libJPEG one?
17:15 < drm> oh, interesting idea
17:15 < dmacks> Similar in that it's "stupid dyld behavior":)
17:15 < dmacks> drm: heh:)
17:16 < Murr> the remedy suggested in the FAQ does not work
17:17 < Murr> hmm
17:17 < Murr> because it was sudo
17:17 < Murr> doing it in a shell got me a bit further
17:19 < dmacks> And for the second time today, I contemplate our non-release of the new base-files pkg.
17:20 < drm> we can be equally proud of the non-release of the new fink-mirrors
17:22 < Murr> also, the libgettext-dev vs. libgettext3 situation seems to be extremely frustrating
17:22 < dmacks> Go us! U.S.A.! U.S.A.!
17:22 -!- citizen_0 [~user@va-sterling-u1-c5c-a-146.chvlva.adelphia.net] has joined #fink
17:22 < drm> murr: right, but we now have a plan for that
17:22 < Murr> is there a RADAR for the linker problem? I'd like to light a fire under somebody's behind FWIW
17:22 < Murr> oh, and what is the plan?
17:23 < dmacks> At least gettextX is deterministic and has a finite solution.
17:23 < Murr> BTW, as far as my package is concerned, you're welcome to move it to stable
17:23 < drm> murr: we need to release fink-0.24.9 and push it to stable first... that will cause the swaps betweent eh libgettext-devs to not error out but to proceed smoothly
17:23 < drm> (thanks, will do so)
17:24 < drm> as far as linker RADARs go, maybe pogma or martin costabel filed one
17:24 < dmacks> (regarding the ->stable email, what needs pygtk-py23?)
17:25 < drm> dmacks: that's part of the python upgrade
17:25 < dmacks> Ah okay. I was gonna say "it's gnome1, why do we need it at all?"
17:26 < dmacks> But may as well have the python thing fixed; others can fight about using old-gnome later:)
17:26 < drm> right
17:29 < dmacks> Murr: pogma committed a fix (setting the FALLBACK variable), but it never got released:( Maybe ask him if it's ready to be released, or is waiting on some other solution to be implemented?
17:29 < Murr> ah yes, the RADAR is 4139432
17:30 < Murr> s'posed to be fixed in 10.4.3. Hoorray!
17:31  * dmacks wonders whatever happened to a plan to give fink some sort of access (other than 'bug msachs') to relevant RADARs?
17:32  * drm never heard of such a plan
17:32 < cirdan> hey
17:32 < drm> hi cirdan
17:32 < cirdan> dmacks: prolly sitting on someone's desk at the bottom of a pile
17:33 < cirdan> dmacks: s/give/get/ :-)
17:33 < drm> BTW: i learned from jeffw, in reponse to my email today, that he does not yet have tiger
17:33 < cirdan> really
17:33 < cirdan> does that mean he's out 10.3 tester now? ;-)
17:33 < Murr> hehe
17:33 < drm> hehe
17:33 < Murr> w as in Whittaker?
17:33 < drm> yeah
17:34 < cirdan> bah... s/out/our/
17:34 < Murr> is he still around?
17:34 < drm> well, he still maintains 200 pkgs
17:34 < cirdan> fink needs site licenses for os x ;-)
17:34 < Murr> I'm maintaining half a tree of workaround packages for his packages
17:34 < dmacks> Murr: Occasionally. He's known to never read trackers...I suspect his users.sf email goes to his old'n'dead noaa account.
17:34 < Murr> cirdan as soon as we have a fink frat house, we can geta  site license
17:35 < cirdan> Murr: but we are incorperated :-)
17:35 < zizban> woot
17:35 < Murr> I sent mail to whatever address was listed in his package
17:35 < cirdan> drm: buy us a frat house?  ;-)
17:35 < zizban> mmm fink frat house
17:35 < drm> murr: he didn't update the addresses on all the pkgs
17:35 < drm> Phi Rho Alpha Tau?
17:35 < drm> doh!
17:35 < dmacks> We could be "Runna Beta"?
17:35 < cirdan> Alpha Fink!
17:35 < Murr> Phi Nu Kappa
17:36 < drm> Phi Nu Kappa... right
17:36 < cirdan> Sierra Echo Xray
17:36 < drm> Phi Ioat Nu Kappa
17:36 < zizban> Lambda Iota Tau LIT
17:36 < Murr> "Come for the keggers. .. stay for the GNOME crashes"
17:36 < zizban> heh
17:36 < drm> can we put it next to the Campus, Murr? the Apple Campus?
17:36 < cirdan> Frat Fink: Where the gnomes crash
17:37 < cirdan> drm: naa, needs to be a few blocks away
17:37 < dmacks> We can have hundreds of them knocked-over on our lawn.
17:37 < cirdan> can't be *too* close
17:37 < Murr> drm maybe on the roof of BJs, accessible via a fire ladder
17:37 < zizban> heh
17:37 < cirdan> w00t. we can use laser wireless :-)
17:37 < dmacks> But instead of actually providing ladders, we have a pile of lumber'n'hardware and you have to build your own?
17:37 < cirdan> suck up apple's oc3
17:37 < Murr> next time we run into a libgettext problem, we throw a Toga party!
17:38 < drm> dmacks: a ladder-maker, written in perl
17:38 < cirdan> dmacks: fink is not linux
17:38 < cirdan> hah
17:38 < dmacks> heh
17:38 < cirdan> can we have a kegger to fixx the dep engine?
17:38 < dmacks> Oh yeah, that'd fix it alright.
17:38 < Murr> cridan true: ofr Linux, you can buy distributions t5hat work
17:38 < cirdan> "can't be worse than previous revision"
17:39 < dmacks> Good point.
17:39 < drm> c'mon, man, it works doesn't it?
17:39 < zizban> heh
17:39 < cirdan> Murr: 1337 sp3ak?
17:39 < Murr> drm I spent 2 days installing etherape
17:39 < cirdan> drm: for varing values of 'work'
17:39 < cirdan> ether-rape
17:39 < cirdan> :-)
17:39 < dmacks> "It's not a dependency engine...it can quit whenever it wants!" Which explains a lot actually.
17:40 < Murr> that's a great slogan
17:40 < cirdan> dmacks: dep steam pump?
17:40 < Murr> did you make it up?
17:40 -!- megahal [~netking@70.85.113.106] has joined #fink
17:40 < cirdan> megahal: feeling better now?
17:40 < drm> co-dependency engine?
17:40 < megahal> cirdan: The sea of space it's hard to measure size and distance accurately. Look closer from now on.
17:40 < Murr> haha
17:40 < drm> megahal: what about time? or spacetime?
17:40 < megahal> drm: Or warp navigation, is scheduled for another time.
17:40 < Murr> Fink-Anon
17:40 < cirdan> megahal: where did you become so wise in the ways of the world?
17:40 < megahal> cirdan: So you have plenty of time to train and prepare for deceleration.
17:41 < drm> megahal: have you been reading science fiction?
17:41 < megahal> drm: You are to go to the brig it would have been six months for all of you, but we were there an hour ago.
17:41 < cirdan> megahal: we are pathetic for talking to you
17:41 < megahal> cirdan: Welcome to the moon, for you and your partner.
17:41 < cirdan> hehe
17:41 < cirdan> must have been
17:41 < cirdan> megahal: have you read hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy?
17:41 < megahal> cirdan: Welcome to the galaxy?
17:42 < cirdan> megahal: welcome back
17:42 < megahal> cirdan: Noriko, if you're back on time it will be launched, fully equipped, by the end of the mass is in the back?
17:42 < cirdan> megahal: the shuttle sucks. we need saturn V rockets again
17:42 < megahal> cirdan: We can't get any due to the brig it would have been six months for all of you, but we were there an hour ago.
17:42 < drm> ooo, a loo
17:42 < drm> loop, even
17:43 < cirdan> megahal: has drm ever explained string theory to you?
17:43 < megahal> cirdan: You are to go to the excelion.
17:43 < dmacks> Yes yes, drm, we all see the outhouse.
17:43 < cirdan> skip to my loo?
17:43 < drm> argh!
17:44 < Feanor> oh yeah
17:44 < cirdan> hey Feanor 
17:44 < drm> he speaks!
17:45 < Feanor> it started crashing again, this time i trained it on a sci-fi anime script
17:45 < Feanor> now it can make jokes about the luminiferous aether
17:45 < zizban> gasp!
17:46 < zizban> all hail hail Feanor 
17:46 < cirdan> megahal: do you  know much about the luminiferous aether?
17:46 < megahal> cirdan: The aether flow!
17:46 < cirdan> megahal: no, the spice must flow!
17:46 < megahal> cirdan: The aether flow!
17:46 < cirdan> megahal: no, the spice must flow!
17:46 < megahal> cirdan: The aether flow!
17:46 < cirdan> heh
17:47 < cirdan> megahal: water flows
17:47 < megahal> cirdan: I reset it and used gunbuster ep 2.
17:47 < cirdan> megahal: do you know feanor's passwords?
17:47 < megahal> cirdan: You are to go to the brig it would have been six months for all of you, but we were there an hour ago.
17:47 < cirdan> megahal: did he tell you his secret passwords?
17:47 < megahal> cirdan: You are to go to the moon, you will all become members of top.
17:47 < drm> he broken
17:48 < Feanor> it doesn't know anything but that script yet, it takes a day or two to make more sense
17:49 < zizban> oh kind of like my students in school
17:49 < cirdan> kindof like the teachers too
17:50 < zizban> yepper :P
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19:21 < msachs> heya pogma
19:22 < pogma> hi
19:23 < msachs> So Kevin figured out exactly what was going on with that thing last night.
19:23 < msachs> Starting with gcc-5215, we no longer put no_toc in the __textcoal_nt section.
19:24 < msachs> I dunno if that's something that you need to know about or not, but I figured I'd share :)
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19:24 < pogma> Which means it gets rannlibbed?
19:24 < pogma> Well, upstream libtool limits the find(1) to names ending in .o and .lo
19:24 < msachs> I guess.
19:25 < msachs> Okay.  I have a test case, should I try it on upstream?
19:26 < pogma> That would be nice (/me says fearfully)
19:26 < pogma> 1.5.18 should work (crossing fingers)
19:26 < msachs> Will it get confused by a universal archive?
19:27 < pogma> it ought not to. I build  fat and run make check occasionally, ppc and ppc64 it passes all tests
19:27 < msachs> Groovy.
19:28 < cirdan> heh
19:28 < cirdan> hey msachs 
19:28 < msachs> Yep, works.
19:28 < msachs> heya cirdan
19:28 < cirdan> dmacks was asking if any radar access was still being sought for fink
19:28 < cirdan> or was it denied
19:29 < msachs> I haven't really had a chance to look into it.
19:29 < mrcucmber> the daapd package is broken, but I wanted to use mt-daapd anyways, google turned up this https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&atid=414256&aid=1113615&group_id=17203  can I take the ,info file put it somewhere and use it to install mt-daapd (I could do it from source but I'd like to use fink's package management if possible)
19:29 < msachs> It's not something I would hold my breath on, though.
19:32 < pogma> radar access for fnk?
19:32 < pogma> msachs: the "yep, works" was for upstream libtool?
19:32 < msachs> pogma: Correct.
19:33 < pogma> *phew*
19:33 < msachs> :)
19:33 < pogma> you wouldn't believe how many times I have changed the fat archive bit in ltmain.sh :)
19:33 < cirdan> hehe
19:34 < msachs> I dunno, I'm pretty credulous :p
19:45 < dmacks> mrcucmber: As is noted in the mtdaapd tracker item, the package created by the .info appears broken.
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19:53 < mrcucmber> dmacks:the daapd port is broken as well :(
19:59 < mrcucmber> *cries*
20:00 < pogma> heh, don't worry, be happy. I have a case of beer that someone gave me as a summer gift, I'll let you have a sip :)
20:01 < zizban> wooot
20:02 < mrcucmber> how do I acess the mtdaapd tracker stuff?
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21:14  * cirdan_ orders mmilitary ..~.
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21:18 < zizban> eh?
21:24  * drm refills cirdan_'s glass :)
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--- Log closed Thu Aug 04 00:00:43 2005